ONE TO WATCH: The Exorcism of Mary Rose

No worries chica! Hope you are having a peachy time! I will be on the road myself later on tonight (Insha'Allah). Look FWd to your responses! xoxo

Salam & Aloha Rihab :)

Heyyyy don?t apologise ? you have not talked my ear off at all! This is getting mighty interesting :)

Lord I can?t for the life of me remember my tenth grade physics, so thumbs up to you! I think the most I can remember from physics is Force = Mass x Acceleration, but I think that?s probably because I paid no attention in class, did little homework and cram studied, hence not remembering much! I took a personality or careers test which told me that I have the ability to make absolute rubbish sound smart and convincing! Damn, should have been a lawyer, I would have raked the money in!

?and finally the realm which covers 99.99% of the knowledge realm which is What we do not realize that we don't know. That percpective is very chilling to me..and humbling is'nt it??

Absolutely! Humans (for example scientists who like to play god) can be so arrogant at times that it drives me insane.

I absolutely agree that that the more ?advanced? countries are more likely to dismiss anything that does not have a scientific explanation. Voodoo however, is more of an African phenomenon, which although mat by present in other 3rd world areas, is not something that?s ingrained in the ?culture? of the country. And this is what interests me! Why not Vietnam or Indonesia for example?

The experience of a co-worker certainly sounds chilling. How is she now? I was once convinced that I had some sort of magic on me for a number of reasons. So I got my mother to call my grandmother in Iraq and seek out this woman that I had heard about who lived in the middle of God knows where! My grandmother sent someone to the lady, and gave my mothers name, who asked what insight she had into me. Anyways she said nothing about any form of magic. The only thing she said was that I was going through a black period and I had experienced an incident with a burglar when I was home alone, and this was causing me distress. It was interesting that she mentioned it was causing me distress, because, although on a conscious level, I did not feel distressed by it, I was at the time having reoccurring dreams about the incident, which no-body knew about. And these dreams manifested over a year after the incident ? during which period I had left London to work in NY for a year. She sent some special water and sugar for me to consume ? not sure what it was supposed to do! I ate the bag of sugar but did not touch the water, because it was post the first gulf war and I didn?t trust what might be in it!

Yes it does not make sense that the symptoms of a ?possessed? person are put down to Dissociative Stress Disorders! This does not account for so much of what hear about what ?possession? is all about! But again, like the whole Voodoo in Africa issues, I am curious as to why we hear more about ?possession? in the Middle East, North Africa and the Asian countries (Pakistan, India, etc.) than for example Europe, or even other Third World Countries where people are not as educated in the realm of psychology. And when they do happen in Europe and the West, they are usually amongst the immigrant communities of these countries. The mother of a girl in my school (Muslim school) was charged with murder when her and a few others killed someone by trying to beat the ?jinn? out of her. In the African regions, when one is ?possessed? they believe it to be by the ?devil? or by a ?witch?. A girl in London (who had been bought here by her Aunt from Angolia) was horrifically and ritualistically tortured by her aunt. Her chest was cut with a knife, chilli peppers were rubbed into her eyes, and she had been repeatedly beaten and starved. This was because she was said to have been ?possessed? by the ?devil?. And sadly and horrifically, such cases, especially involving children are on the increase.

Do you know the family of the Libyan girl who was murdered by her husband here in London in February of 2003? She was in the year below me at school. A very pretty and sweet girl. Apparently her husband had split personality disorder or schizophrenia, which she knew about. He killed himself a few weeks later whilst in prison.

I enjoyed watching the series The Afterlife. Whenever the Medium explained something that had happened or was happening, the Psychologist (who was a bit of a cutie) always came back at her with a ?psychological explanation?. You might find it interesting to watch if you can get your hands on it.

I agree with you that it is absolutely rubbish that speaking in a foreign language in a ?possessed? state can be attributed to subconscious learning. It makes no sense at all. But again, is it ?possession?? Or something way beyond the realms of knowledge we will ever acquire. Again, playing Devils Advocate, one could say that perhaps all of these languages exist in our brains already through Godly intervention ? and maybe they come out of some people in certain ?states?.

As for magic and voodoo being used for good, I am just curious as to why magic and voodoo is always associated with evil. I mean, on the one hand I don?t disbelieve it exists, but being a devils advocate one could argue that, if it did exist, it could be an amazing tool for society. For example, if one has the power to create a doll of someone, and then break its leg, manifesting into a real breakage on the person, then surely the opposite could happen, and one could use a doll to mend a broken leg. Something like this would be tremendous for the medical world. But we don?t see anything like this. By the same example, if magic has the ability to knock someone?s house down, then the same magic should be able to fix a knocked down house. Again, we see none of this. It would solve so many problems the world over.

When I look at the world of politics, the sequence of events, the outcomes, and what is happening in society, I sometimes think that it?s a possibility that certain factions in the world are ruled by magic. We know from our history that ?certain peoples? were notorious for their use with magic back in the days, so why not now too?

As for the evil eye, some say that we take it too literally. For example, the explanation that someone gave me the other day was as follows: Someone?s jealousy and contempt can manifest in something bad happening to another person, but only through direct intervention of the ?jealous? person. For example, you might apply for a job which I do not want you to get. My jealousy can cause me to do everything in my power to make sure you do not get it.

I dunno!

Have you ever had your mind read? I have. A man came up to me once whilst I was waiting for a friend in London. He said that he could tell me things beyond my comprehension. I told him that he had to prove himself to me before I agreed whether to do a reading with him or not. So he asked me a series of questions, but told me not to answer the questions out loud. After each question he wrote something down on a piece of paper. Then he screwed up the paper, said something on it, moved it in a circular motion over some sort of chart, and then told me to close my palm over it. He then asked me the same questions again, and asked me to give him the answers out loud this time. So I did. Then he asked me to open up the paper. I did, and all my answers were written down. But then again, taking the stance of a Devils Advocate, I could argue that if it was possible, why don?t these people learn how to play poker for example, and travel the world making serious money?

I do agree that we can as individuals subconsciously control our conscious environment. But do you believe that collectively, a group of people can subconsciously control something? For example the ouija board as I mentioned before. I have tried it a few times, but only one experience stands out for me. We spoke to a ?spirit? called Ted, which was supposedly killed in a boating accident in 1837. This was during lunch break in high school. Because I went to a Muslim school, we use to pray after every lunchtime break. Anyways, as soon as a adhan started (on speakers in every room) the glass we were using seemed to just move from underneath us. It hit the leg of the table (not with any great force) but smashed into soooooooooo many small pieces, and each piece was shattered. Had I taken the glass myself and thrown it with all my might against a wall or the floor, it would not have broken to the same extremity at all! It was bizarre. Now, do I believe we communicated with a dead person? No. But what I am asking is, do you think that it is possible that the 4 of us, subconsciously somehow all moved the glass towards the same letter and in the same direction ? hence all of our fingers naturally following the same path. And then we collectively subconsciously influenced the movement of the glass?

I will deffo try to check the movie out! It?s interesting to hear that an American woman has something other than her gynecologist, tricologist, and dermatologist!

OK now I have to apologise for the ever so long entry! Look forward to your response! This isn?t a very active village is it!?!

Oh and I just read the results of a poll that was taken here in the UK which showed that more people believe in ghosts than in God!

Aloha Rihab, thanks for the comments. You present a very good and highly plausible perspective on this.

The secrets of the world and the universe are beyond our comprehension and we will only ever know a small fraction of the entire picture. By the same measure, the human brain, its intricacies, complexities, and its boundaries, are something which we will only ever fathom on a small scale. We have no idea what the potential for our brain is, and the ways in which it can possibly affect us and everything around us. We have no idea to what extent and how it can absorb things, and what from this, can manifest itself into scenarios and experiences which we find ?abnormal? or have no explanation for.

This topic fascinates me, but like so many, one runs the risk of stemming off into a plethora of branches, and thus becoming highly confused. The possibilities are infinite, and will never all be proved or disproved.

I have no doubt in the existence of alternate universes and dimensions, hence, like you so rightly mentioned, the world of the Jinn. To what extent we interact, I have no idea. But I do always leave the Quran playing in my bedroom even when I am not about, because I do believe that the Jinns can hear it.

A few thoughts:

1) Why do you think that some things are more prevalent in some parts of the world than in others? For example, voodoo, is rooted in 6000 years of African history, with over 60 million people worldwide practicing it today. We hear about it in places like Cuba, Brazil and America, but through the ancestors of African slaves, and also in the UK, but amongst immigrant African communities. Why would this not be a worldwide phenomenon inherent in all cultures? By the same measure, we hear more stories of ?possession? amongst Middle Eastern, North African and Asian cultures, than any other. On the one hand we can say that it can be through lack of education about Brain disorders (which I believe it is to part), but then why would these ?experiences? not be prevalent in other third world countries?

2) Psychologists can put down ?possession? to Brain disorders like schizophrenia, but how can it account for an individual spouting out a plethora of languages in their ?possessed? state?

3) Why are all accounts of spirits, magic, voodoo and possession highly negative and illustrating ?evil?? If voodoo dolls can be used through spirits and/or an alternate dimension, then why do we never hear accounts of dolls being used to heal people as opposed to destroying them? Muslims always say that only ?bad? jinns interact with humans? Why? And on what basis?

4) How do psychologists account for mind readers? Or people, who, when given the name of someone, even without meeting them, can give an account of their life so far and experiences they have been through? Why aren?t such people used in the medical world to help those who are suffering from amnesia?even if its small stepping stones to test the waters and get them going?

5) In the same way that people can learn to control their dreams through lucid dreaming, do you think that we can subconsciously affect things around us in the same way? For example, 4 people using the oujia board, somehow subconsciously influencing the direction the pointer moves in?

Have you ever had any experiences yourself Rihab?

Lord, sorry this is so long!!!!!

Thanks for the input chica. For the 3rd day in a row I am on 2-3 hours sleep so if I tried to respond now I would make about as much sense as a cockateil on speed attempting to immitate jibbersih! But I will be back later on today :)

Peachy. Look FWD to it :)

I'm fully aware of what my profile picture is. I'm not quite sure I understand:

1) Your point
2) What you think the relevance is to this topic.

First of all in your profile picture you can see the World Trade Towers in New York city before they were knocked down by the 9/11 terrorist acts!

Jinns exists and are real for as it is mentioned in the Quran and Sunnah of Prophet Mohammed (pbuh).

Chemical brain disorders and schizophrenia are also real and cause people to think in very strange and demented ways.

Mental disease and disorders are now finally being discussed in public and we are learning more about their profound impact on people.

How to distinguish medium/possessed humans from those who are having a chemical brain malfunction is impossilbe to tell right now. They probably leave the same chemical trail in the brain.

Allah(swt) is the lord of the worlds. There are many words and we don't know them all and how they work and their true impact on us humans. For example, bacteria and viruses can have adverse affects on us humans and we donot fully understand them.

We see what we think!

Information theory states you can always find what you are looking for any large amount of data from noise available through data manipulation and in the how our brain works we realize we filter out much data to match what we expect in the natural world.

I think therefore I am!
I think thefefore I see!
I think therefore I must be right!
If I start to think differently then I become different from whom I was!