Uh, but maybe it wont be as bad as aligning with the people who massacred his family, and "sahabas". just a thought.

wa iyyaak :)

SS, thanks bro, I stand corrected, it was Imam Shafi'i.

Jazaka Allah khair.

Keeper bro, that quote about never beating an ignorant in a debate (meaing that the ignraont will never admit defeat, but will still think he won, like the shia here) that quote was by Imam Shafi'i not sayyiduna Ali (ra.).

I got busy so I'll have to join u here later. salam alaikum.

and overdoing the love for ahlul bait by beating yourselves to a pulp wouldn't put you in the Prophet.s good books by the way with all that hatred for his companions.

if that makes you happy you keep thinking that. God knows what's in my heart and everyone else's who isn't on some deviant path.

On the other hand, hating abu bakr, umar and uthman would be contradicting everything the Prophet s.a.w has said about them, so I can see it from the other side that you're completely defying the Prophet s.a.w. and hence don't like him if you don't like his companions.

The keeper and ziad,

1. you support mauviyah, ibn ziyad, shimr, and marwan by at the very least not categorically dissociating yourself from them and at the most siding with them. They were staunch enemies of bani hashim. and so that makes you enemy of bani hashim. Keeper, very smart, the Rasool was also bani hashim, so if you side with enemies of the ahlul-bayt, you become the Prophet's enemy too. Nuff said.

2. You cannot pick and choose to claim yourselves in favor of the Prophet, but side with "sahabas" against his children. Keeper, would you be friends with a person who God forbid massacred your chlidren and their children? i didnt think so.

3. I know you have a dillema, you "love these people to death" and love Imam Ali's family to. Now you have to reconcile, and come to terms with the fact they hated each other. One side massacred the other. So good luck, coming to terms with that.

Khiladi: I wonder which opression in your mind you are thinking of. Anyways, Imam has come to guide the people to stay on the Prophet's message. Not to keep correcting the mistakes of his enemies. There is a difference. Allah has said in Quran that a nation needs to make justice a reality, Imam Ali calls the Muslims to enforce justice, thats the whole poing.

Khiladi, bro,

You probably already realize they will imagine you never said that right?....Remember,

Mohammed Ali in his fights says "stick and move, stick and move"

these guys say "pick and choose, pick and choose"...

They'll never beat you on all the facts you present bro...

Please correct me if I'm wrong bro, but Sayyidna Ali (r.A.) , I believe, said that he will beat any knowledgeable person in a debate but will NEVER beat an ignorant person....

he is absolutely right... how do you beat ignorance?...it stands on no basis.

Keeper..

Imam Shafii (R) said,

"If love of ahl-bayt means I am rafidhi, THAN I AM RAFIDHI...."

This was one of the sunni's greatest imams, and they claim sunnis do not love the Prophet's family....

But Mehnaz... in Nahjul Balagha, there are countless speeched of Ali (R) saying he's come to do just that... CORRECT THEM....

He was rising up against the oppression...

And I like the American mentality some shias hold ..."if you're not with us, you're against us". Just because I don't go around cursing the hell out of everyone, it means I love those people to death and hate Ali's family.

Now THAT's LOGIC, the twisted type. Enough said.

the logic I follow is narrations of the Prophet s.a.w. and once again I reiterate that the teflonics we've been arguing with, will twist and turn around each point that is made to them...yet when they come up with something out of their rear ends with one weak narration, and it is disproven, all they know how to say is "you guys don't get it, we use logic".

If that's logic, someone wake me up because I think I'm living in the land of Oz.

Ziad, bro, trust me, the hatred they have for the Prophet s.a.w. companions (may Allah;'s prayers and blessing be upon them) far surpasses any hatred we have for anyone. They are brainwashed into thinking we hate bani hashim (in essence, the idiots are accusing us of hating the Prophet's s.A.w. family, hence, the Prophet himself (since he is of bani Hashim). When their "infallible" (I can;t say this without laughing) imams tell them we're evil and they, the poor minority are undermined because of the evil evil sunnis hating on Ali and the family of the Prophet, these people are like sheep and believe everything that is said. And what do they hide under?...this banner of "oh you guys oppress us time and time again...oh you hate the Prophet's family, oh we are the poor minority that is thinking right, and the billions of you are all on the wrong track...oh the companions are nowhere near as good as how the Prophet s.a.w. described them"...SAY WHATTT? The Prophet himself said some hadiths about his sahaba praising them?...

You guys are pretty dumb, logic doesnt appeal to you.

Imam Ali doesnt have to think out loud in a cartoon cloud like your Caliphs, his thoughts and actions are beyond that. The concept is that if the people are treacherous enough to loot the Prophet's household, then it should remain as an example, the event securing a wedge between the truthful and the hippocrites. Of course, Imam Ali avoidid warring and fighting to ensue had he taken back Fadak.

What you, the partisans and Mauwiyah and Yazid dont realize is that Imam Ali is not supposed to go arround constantly correct the mistakes your forefathers made. Sometimes you guys have the bear the consequences of you own actions, whether here or in the afterlife.

And no boys, we dont worry ourselves with what you, the enemies of Bani Hashim think of us.

you shia's don't stand a chance, I predict you will resort to khanaseeb's tactics, posting 'bidda , bidda wahabi bidda' over 50 times. stupid bastard..

actually SilkySword... on this forum it is becoming quite evident that sanad to them means "its in the sunni books'... and that 'our scholars' accept eveything that is in the sunni books..

also, who told u ali thought 'if i take fadak, they'll say i stole it'??? is this a narration in ur books, or r u the only one in its sanad??? looool!! u r not talking to shia here, who believe just ANYONE or ANYTHING said blindly!! we are the men of sanad; we tought this to the world!! what's ur sanad on that 'narration'? lol

and since i know u dont have a sanad, who told u u can think on ali's behalf or put words in his mouth or 'imagine' his response to this question??? he was eloquent, and like u cite our books on fatimah wanting fadak and lots of other things, y dont u cite ali's position on fadak too?? or did we hide it while we didn't hide fatimah's??

and if what u said was true and was what ali thougth and did, y don't u follow his example and 'worry' about what muslims think of u?? u r a deviant sect today with 'cucu' beliefs and practices. u should learn from ur 'imam' and care about ur image in front of the MAJORITY / BULK of ppl around u (us, sunnis) :)

every question u couldn't answer is black stain all over u, nor just ur face, but all over u!! u r the majoos trying to get back at muslims who destroyed their empire!!! u can't hide it!!! even with the feather on 'abul fadl al-abbas's turban..that feather is from the pre-islamic persian majoosi influence!!!! u won't fool us!!! we know history well! we know our enemy well!!

we'd have said he stole it??? i DARE you to show examples from our books that we'd refer to ali like that or talk badly about him or any of ahlulbayt!!! i dare u!!! i give a 100 years, pass it to ur grandkids if u will, to bring just ONE proof of us talking like that about ali or anyone you hold dear and think we don't!!!! u r a complete fool, mehnaz!!! u dont know at all how we view ahlubayt!!! the B.S. u heaer in ur husseiniyyahs brainwashed u!!!

u need to stop being contradictory!!! ali wouldn't fear anyone if he was doing the right thing!! and being a khalifah with power, what would stop him??? ppl are asked to obey the ruler in islam!!! ali would take his right even if it were in a lion's mouth!!! but u make ali a failure, a coward, and we warn you from continuing in insulting our noble muslim figures!!! u claim u love him but u r only making him look bad with the lies u spread on how he was like!!!

u'll forever be a fool!!!! u think u've turned the table on us??? fadak wasn't taken by ali cuz he supported abu bakr's position on the issue!!! and that hadith abu bakr cited i can show u a page from khomeini's book where khomeini cited it when it suited his WHIMS!!!!! u r the most dishonest, stupid people from among all earth's inhabitants!!!!

lastly, ur imams do break all the laws of nature!!! they are infallible, they know the unseen, they live forever (like ur mahdi), they know thousands of languages, they are born from their moms' thighs (too pure to come out of 'elsewhere' ,...etc etc etc -and i have scanned pages that support what i'm saying!

u've been always the clown of this village. for god's sake, readers, look at her logic "if eh restored fadak, u'd have said he stole it'!!!!! hahahahaha!!!

why didn't abu bakr take it for himself, then??? or....did he make his daughter aysha inherit the messenger??? DID HE???? PROVE THAT HE DID!!!! OR DID OMAR MAKE HAFSA INHERIT???? WOULDN'T THE PROPHET'S WIVES INHERIT SOMETHING TOO???? we'd believe u, liars, if the wives got something but fatimah (ra.) was denied!!!!!

Because if he had restored fadak, you would have said that he stole it. Now fadak remains forever a black stain on your face. The Imams do not break the laws of nature, their perils time and time again separate Haqq from Batil.

the Shia ignore our hadith on Fatimah reconciling with Abu Bakr and finally submitting to the hadith he narrated on the issue of her 'inheriting' Fadak!

Have to ask the Shia this question AGAIN AND AGAIN AND AGAIN AND AGAIN (and I NEVER got an answer!!!): WHY on earth did Ali NOT restore Fadak when he became Khalifah????

let me add a new one too: WHY did he not move the bodies of Abu Bakr and Omar from beside the prophet's...when he became Khalifah???

u want to say 'afraid'? 'concerned for the unity of Muslims'?? ok, then why are YOU NOT LIKE HIM 'concerned for the unity of muslims'??? or, if he was afraid, can he still be viewed as 'al-Karrar'??????

We hold that everything you hold to be true..is utter falsehood, so Ali is a karrar, and Fatimah wouldn't wish for something and Muslims would delay fulfilling her a wish, but deen comes first. Prophet's hadiths are inspired to him, and if he said he doesn't pass inheritence, then that's a DIVINE decree we don't go against.

you need to be raised on respecting divine decrees, shia kids.