Hope you enjoy it, and safe travels!

Himalaya53, i can't disagree with you.. regardless of anything and everything, we shouldn't stand back and not do a thing (my argument never suggested that) and thanks for the book recommendation; all the local bookstores are out of it (it must be good). i ordered my copy to read while on the plane. salam.

i was in egypt all this time. and the people in egypt were mad about what happend in sharm el shiekh. from following the news over there, it's very abvious that there is invisible hands behind this attack. Sharm el shiekh is one of the beautiful places in egypt, and one of the most secure place. it's full of security. and no one knows how 2 Mini Bus explode like that. they actually targeting the egyptian economic.

you've made your point ya afendi, chill. mohamad and ahmed, you both made compeling arguments and both hold valued opinions. but remember its within our own community where the strength needs to be our foundation for a strong ummah. enough said.

So if you see a crooked nail, replace it with a straight one...

Morsy- realism, pessimism, or optimism really doesnt matter at this point. Its our responsibility to do something other than issue press releases. Regardless of what has happened in the past... the pinnacle of the Islamic empire, the Crusades, or past terror operations... frankly doesnt matter. I'd say its a bit more about today, and the future. We'll be judged on our existence on earth. This isnt about starting an organization- but a shift in mentality in our communities... and its about us standing up for what we believe in in our own communities. I'm not gonna affect a cave in Pakistan, nor will any of us. But I can speak out in my own communities. I could be pessimistic and say, khalas- nothing will change and go about my merry way. I agree, its a bad situation, but some of us choose not to just sit there and do nothing. If we're not gonna stand up for our faith, who will. Michael Wolfe wrote a book called "Taking Back Islam"... check it out. Its a good read. Salams.

I?m not trying to sound pessimistic, but rather a realist. Hitting a crooked nail on its head isn?t going to do you any good! It?s shocking how some people act like ?Islamic? terrorism never existed prior to this century.. But fine, let?s lead the way and start an organization, who is going to be your target? Coward terrorists hiding in caves in Pakistan or wahabis and salafis in your local mosque?

Himalaya, mashallah you hit the nail right on the head. We can, and we have to lead ours.

Its our responsibility to fill that void. King and Ghandi were mortals. They led their communities. We can all lead ours.

I join the rest of you in expressing my frustration with the current situation and pray to Allah that it would get better soon (doubtful..) Gandhi didn?t endorse terrorism to reach his goals. His presence voided the chance of a violent extermist party to have their way. And so was the case with Martin Luther King. His leadership and peaceful fight for his people?s rights prevented violent black gangsters from pursuing their agenda. Muslims don?t have a Gandhi. We don?t have a King! That simply leaves room for those idiots committing those atrocities.

Jazakum Allah Khair Himalaya.. I absolutely agree with you, and it was wonderfully said. Believe me, I am absolutely sickened and disgusted by what is going on in our world. The things happening to our people, by our people, in our country and abroad etc. There is definitely no justification whatsoever for the actions that have been taking place. None. I just don't know if the reason is as clear cut as a patriarchal regime. It's a very complicated and involved issue encompassing all of what you said and then some. I guess what really pisses me off is that aside from all muslims getting the blame for this crap, there are always those that stand up and readily apologize for it to the international community. Why should we apologize, especially in internal affairs.. Why should we apologize for the one american life lost, when there was 70+ egyptian/muslim lives lost? besides.. what good are apologizes anyway.. they do no good. You are right aymoon we need to do something about this.. but its going to have to be fighting fire with fire. It is our duty to take care of this problem and resolve it.. not by calling on the aid of america or anyone else, thats probably one reason why a lot of this stuff is occurring as well. We do need to take responsibility, but saying it.. and doing it are two different things.

Pfunkie- you're right that going in like Afghanistan isnt really all that effective, and that we've gotta go to the root of the issue... its several roots, not just one. However, I don't think we're really dealing with people being "too religious"... when I say extreme, its not about their love of God.... its about a complete misinterpretation of deen that causes them to lose the very essence of that faith vis a vie distruction, and a flawed patriarchy. Our faith is about harmony and balance... we see it in the life of the prophet... dont eat too much, just till you're satisfied... hell and heaven mentioned the same number of times in the quran... where there is man, there is woman.... where there is sunlight and day, there is darkness and night... this universe is built on the premise of harmony. When that is upset, you get oppression, injustice, and imbalance. That is what our jihad is- to find that balance in our lives. The prophet told the dude at the mosque praying 24-7 that it wasnt right... because he was neglecting his duties as a citizen- faith isnt just about your beard, hijab, or how many times you pray, or how many surahs you know, or what worldly posessions you give up for God.... For us as humans (in my opinion of course) faith is also about your daily walk ... you being a member of your community to alleviate the quality of life for all... its about how you use your blessings, and if your blessing comes in the way of a car or cel phone or the internet... so be it, it can be used for good. An extreme and violently literal interpretation of any religious text in my opinion is not a healthy one... for the individual, the community, or society as a whole. I really think a lot of this is about patriarchal control in communities. Some of these guys are against women being educated... as they see it as a threat to male dominance of a closed culture... whereas true Islam is of a feminist nature (gender equality- recognizing differences)... some of these guys are against certain western ways of life... capitalism... when the Prophet and his own wife were in business... this is about fear and control. Its about obsession thats gotten out of hand. These folks need to realize that while yes, there are certain things in western lifestyles that are Islamically not favorable, it comes down to the individual human before his creator to make those decisions. Its not up to some mullah in a cave to decide that he is the chosen one to punish the people of a certain country through a violent fatwa. Thats bullshit. I said it once and I got some flack for it... I dont mean this disrespectfully- but Allah would never tap any of us on the shoulder and say judge for ME because I dont feel like doing it anymore.... How ARROGANT of a human to think that we could ever step in God's place to either place a heaven/hell judgement on someone... or even take their life. Islam gives us certain rules of engagement in times of oppression or war. Clearly, if these people who are fighting have issues, they're not dealing with them properly- or Islamically. Its hypocritical and frankly is an insult to our faith. I'm now actually more offended by Muslims doing this stuff than I am by the Pentagon.... we should know better. We've got a blessing and these folks are throwing it away... and dragging it through the dirt thinking that by protecting their dominance of a community or an ummah- that people will respect them for the length of their beard and the "piousness" of their community standing at that point. whatever.

There is nothing wrong with being "very Muslim" ... because if you're "very Muslim" there is no way in creation that this destruction towards innocents, property, communities, and societies could be supported. While some folks have reverted to Islam in the last few years, there has been a TON of damage to our image. Yall know that.

I just want to say one thing.. while yes i agree with you aymoon and I agree with you Himalaya on your points of view, I must say I am upset that we have resorted to using the words "fundamentalists" or "extremists" to those who practice their deen. What is a fundamentalist.. It is a person who adheres to the fundamentals of certain principles, in this case their religion, to the basic ideology. We call them extremists because they want to pursue the practice of their religion to the fullest extent. Is there really such a thing as being "TOO religious". NO, there isn't. We cant be religious enough, we can't worship Allah enough, and we never will. If other's want to use the term as something bad and corrupt then let them.. but why should we do the same? They have distorted the very meaning of the word into something criminal and taboo. We can say that certain people have misinterpreted the deen. That they have changed the shariah to their own whims and desires, and this may very well be true. And yes, its not solely the faults of the jews or america or anyone else. We hold the biggest blame for our predicaments. But you have to ask yourself WHY? Why has it gotten this way and this far? What is forcing people to do such things. The answer is much more involved then what you may think. It's not as simple as saying they are loonies or what not. What has driven them to this point of "lunacy" to begin with. We are partially blind to it because we don't get a chance to see it first hand, most of us anyway. When we go back to egypt, most of us have an enjoyable time. We have the money, we go there for vacation and relaxation, and then we know we will be returning to our normal lives again while the rest of the 60+ million are left to suffer. It's hard for us to grasp why these things are happening. To condemn the actions would also be a fault of ours, because we are condemning a people who are distraught and perhaps their only way to raise an issue and get attention is by doing what they are doing, as wrong as it may be. We have to get to the root of the issue. We have to come up with a resolution where all factions can meet in the middle and be somewhat content with the results. To arrest these people, to find every single one of them, to go into countries and "root" them out like in afghanistan (Bs war), is not the solution. It would be a never ending battle. One must take a stand back and examine all angles and see why the state of affairs has gotten to this point. And as much as you may not want to hear it or agree with it.. The foreign policies of america and others has a huge roll in all this, as well as egypt's own governmental policies over its people. These are things that cannot be ignored.

Amen Mohammed!! No one could've said it better ;)

I'm tending to agree with Aymoon on this one... while yes we're not silent about the issues, what do our constant stream of condemnations and press releases do? Sure we have dialogues, and they are much needed. But as Muslims, we largely just ignore the wackos in our own community... rather than getting them to stop. Just as its our responsibility to lobby against the Patriot Act or to advocate for Palestinian rights... its our responsibility to get these loonies to cut it out. Press releases and condemnation statements are fine and dandy, but they only go so far. However people are upset about US policy, Israel, blah blah blah... its no excuse to carry it out this way. Islamically speaking, there are rules of engagement for war. Oh, and another thing... I'm really getting sick of everyone blaming Israel and/or Jews for everything... I'm not gonna pretend like they don't have blood on their hands, as they are guilty of their own attrocities... but please- lets get away from the constant stream of conspiracy theories and actually do something instead of scapegoating all the time. We'll never move forward if we keep blaming everything that goes wrong on Israel. Furthermore, there is little dialogue about the kooky fundamentalism going on in our mosques... fatwas being issued about "its ok to kill other muslims as long as you're killing a kafir" ... what the hell is that about? The issue is our own. We've ignored it, we've ignored the salafi and wahabi ways of thought... we've ignored the Saudi influence in our mosques around the world. Remember, Ghandi and MLK were faced with dire situations- we're not the first people on the face of the earth to be discriminated against and treated badly... they took the higher ground and their people benefited... they united and bound around a cause. We can't seem to do the same.

I never meant to mean that the people who do suicide bombings are no longer considered muslims.. I meant to say that maybe it isn't muslims at all that are doing it in the first place. And aymoon.. no one is upset with you yakhuya. I think what we need to do before any action is taken is to find out why these things are happening. To get an understanding of why is there such desperate acts occuring and by whom.. and what is their agenda and what do they want to achieve by their acts, if in fact this is a homegrown issue. I could care less for condomning what is being done. Clearly blowing up innocent people and yourself is an act anyone would shun. But still, I haven't heard your proposal of what we should be doing to help prevent all this? Is it to push harder to have a change in foreign policy? Is it to push harder to have america remove its troops from the mideast? Is it to aid in a revolution and have a change in power in the arab nations? what exactly do you propose?

I do agree with Aymoon in that we are sum what responsible in the fact that we as a group dont provide alternatives. Frankly all we do is condem and to some people thats not moving fast enough so the decide to take matters in to their own hands. I wonder if people in Egypt and the arab world still agree with 9-11.Many people said they dotn approve of it but still they Americans had it comming. Now that they are experiencing this home grown problem have they changed their minds. Probably the fact that most of these scholars try to hold the stick from the middle suicide bombing is ok some of the time but not all the time. We need to address the root of the issue

I see why everyone is upset with me. Saying that we are responsible is pretty harsh provided the nature of the act. For that I apologize. What I meant is that condemning these acts never stopped them. The underlying causes are still there. Some Muslims are doing something about it but other aren't. It doesn't really matter who is doing what. What matters is that we, the umma, haven't done enough. Even if we try to talk about the beauty of Islam and show it, still those attacks are going to make it hard for us to change the image of Islam. We need to tackle the cause. I believe that we need to demonstrate to our fellow Muslims overseas that civil ways are more effective to achieve justice. As for the claim that those who commit these acts are not Muslims, I disagree :). I have talked to many common people in Egypt and I can see how many are getting desperate to a point that they are ready to participate in such crimes. I was there when the attacks of 9/11 took place and the response of the common uneducated people was not good at all. You will be surprised that many educated people reacted in a shameful way as well. There's a lot of education and ideological struggles that needs to take place inside the Muslim community to be able to demonstrate the beauty of Islam to the world. just my 2 cents.

I agree with Theanisa. I see your point aymoon.. but thats assuming that the so called "terrorists" are muslim to begin with.. I will not make that assertion at this point and time. There are plenty of ways to make a difference and be active.. The very character that we carry ourselves with in front of others, our everyday normal interaction with those that may fear us and not understand us, our show casing of true islam and it's beauty.. that speaks volumes, and does wonders to change or at least allow others to question what people are told about muslims. A simple kind gesture, a simple kind word, can make a world of a difference. Secondly, I believe most of us here are professionals.. either in the work force, or working on degrees to better ourselves and our communites. I for one am nearly done with medical school and will be a Doctor very soon Insha'allah. And when I think of the degree I am going for.. I think to myself that I am helping the muslimeen by becoming educated and insha'allah being able to help even more in the future here and abroad. Our status in society sometimes comes to our benefit if we use it wisely, our voices can be heard more louder and taken more seriously. We can do more in the long run.. You say we need to take responsibility and change things.. Thats all good, and akeed is a must.. but what exactly do you propose that you do not see others already doing?

Unfortunately, Islam is in trouble in this country. Every post to this thread calls for actions to be taken to show those who don?t know much about Islam that it?s a religion of peace. We are so motivated and good at explaining to Americans why the recent terrorist attacks are not so Islamic. Yet, we never care about being proactive and for example joining our local communities in a cancer walk! That's where we should start.